June 8, 2008
GWC Podcast #103
The week we take on the penultimate BSG 4.0 episode. Highlights: we discuss Baltar’s “confession” (and really detailed wound), debate how having a cylon wife might affect marriage vows (and subsequent verbal contracts), laud the restraint of cylon flight suit fashion designers, note Roslin’s slow and thorough walk to the Dark Side, question the requirement that cylons give up their immortality to earn trust (but recognize the war implications of unlimited re-spawns), discuss Elosha’s brief return to BSG, enjoy Three’s “psyche!” moment, analyze the 4.0 finale trailer, and wonder if there are any “chick centurions.”
Galactic Watercooler 
Modern Geek 
Save Eureka 
Eff This Week 
FitSmart
Hooray!
yay! I’ve been checking constantly!
Taking a shower is good for something!
BKitty is onto something there. Since Adama puts his wedding ring on Laura’s hand in her death scene vision, doesn’t he become “The Hub” as well?
Wrong hand.
Hey gang,
I really appreciated the discussion on the Mammy figure. Elosha, whether it’s intended or not, DEFINITELY pushes some cultural buttons, and says more, actually about our culture than it does about Battlestar Galactica. Audra, you are awesome.
standard signoffs:
Why are there no Filipinos in space?
I am a Cylon.
/end standard signoffs.
Thanks, jp! I responded to your post in the forum as well.
Chuck, I Loved last week’s episode. Romo was great. Lee was great. Everything was great! It’s called character development.
Hello Sean, Chuck and Audra,
I just listened to the podcast and I have to disagree with all three of you on the Roslin front. Sorry, but I just feel that this time you guys didn’t get it. I am not a Roslin fan, but I think MARY McDONNELL is frakking fantastic and perhaps the best actress on television, and this is why I think you guys missed the point. Basically, as Chuck and Sean said, they are against Roslin, fine, but the point of contention was that she was turning Vader and that her walk on the subconscious side yielded NO results because she reverted back to old behavior by betraying the cylons. Firstly, let us make this clear: She told Helo to bring the 3 to her BEFORE she had her revelation with ELOSHA. So the 3 was coming into that room regardless. That was a predetermined plan. Secondly, Roslin had the 3 and the only question she asked was about the five, which I am sorry, but if you KNOW the 3 knows about the five and you are the LEADER of all humanity, and your voyage home rests with what this woman knows, you guys can’t fake it like you would be on a moral high horse like, “Oh my gawd! I so have to share this info with my supposed cylon allies who may or may not blow the rest of my fleet to hell when I’m not looking.” Please. Spare me.
Also, the whole Baltar thing. Are you guys kidding me? What did I miss? The man admitted he killed everyone! He admitted that everyone she knew and loved and everyone that entire fleet knew and loved, died because of him. But he had the nerve to say GOD WANTED HIM TO. That he was right. She was having a breakdown hearing that. She was falling apart. How would you guys take that? “Oh, yeah, I found god, but you should know that I only found him AFTER I helped destroy the whole human race.” Screw that. I love Baltar, he’s my favorite character, but sorry, not even I would have let that slide.
And let us not forget 3 played a mind game and diplomacy went out the window. Roslin realized that she wasn’t going to get the info that easily and that the 3 had her own plans. This isn’t going to be easy—getting the 3 to talk. She doesn’t even trust her OWN kind. So, who’s the manipulator here? Really.
Finally, Mary McDonnell does a lot with the character that is not always in words. The thing is, you have to pay attention to the body language and the facial expressions just as much as you pay attention to what she is saying. Once you guys start to realize that, then maybe, just maybe you will get to the crux of Roslin’s true nature.
Although I doubt it, because as much as I love your podcast, I am getting a little tired of the Roslin dis-like. It’s one thing if she was truly as evil as you guys claim, but it’s a whole other thing when you guys, podcast after podcast, never take the time to even remotely comprehend the character.
She may very well be the best written female character on television. I just had to say that. And, by the way, I am a Baltar fan all the way, but Roslin…Roslin is just dope!
Well, that’s all I have to say. Knock me or praise me or whatever. But seriously, I think that once people make up their minds to dislike a certain character, they will always try to find things to continually convince them that their dislike is valid. Seems to me Roslin haters exercise this belief way too much. It’s just getting played out.
Amee
You guys were talking about the hiatus, it won’t really be a year will it???????? How long has it been in the past?
A pet peeve of mine: the term “african-american” is not a blanket term for people with dark skin.
The actress who plays Elosha is Canadian, and therefore NOT african-american. If anything like that, she’s african-canadian. This is one case where trying to be PC makes you sound ignorant.
Meh. Canada is in the Americas.
It’s accepted in the US that “american” means “from the united states”, and the term originated there.
meh back.
@amee,
I was going to post the same thing, you beat me to it. Roslyn isn’t thinking of herself, or the high moral ground, or how she will be remembered, or anything else. Just her people’s survival.
>>This is one case where trying to be PC makes you sound ignorant.
Anon:
It’s true that if the actor is Canadian, then she is indeed not “African American.” I wrongly assumed the actor was American.
However, in my field of African American/Black Studies (AABS), the term “African American” is not considered a “PC” term. It is often the preferred identifier, depending on the individual. You may also notice that I used “black” and “African American” interchangeably when I spoke, which includes non-Americans.
I’m sorry if you found our discussion of ethnic stereotypes to be “ignorant.” I, for one, found it interesting and deserving of relevant discussion.
>>Sorry, but I just feel that this time you guys didn’t get it. I am not a >Roslin fan, but I think MARY McDONNELL is frakking fantastic and perhaps >the best actress on television…
In fact, we are huge Mary McDonnell fans. In previous podcasts we’ve discussed our ideal interview with her and our favorite McDonnell movie roles.
>>Firstly, let us make this clear: She told Helo to bring the 3 to her BEFORE >>she had her revelation with ELOSHA. So the 3 was coming into that room >>regardless. That was a predetermined plan.
Correct. This indicates clearly that she was willing to sabotage diplomacy, even peace, to get the information she wanted. Elosha showed up afterward as the voice of conscience.
>>you guys can’t fake it like you would be on a moral high horse like, “Oh >>my gawd! I so have to share this info with my supposed cylon allies who >>may or may not blow the rest of my fleet to hell when I’m not looking.†>>Please. Spare me.
Are you sure you’re referring to our podcast? I don’t recall any of us advocating this view.
>>Also, the whole Baltar thing. Are you guys kidding me? What did I miss? >>The man admitted he killed everyone!
Yep. We’ve had lengthy discussions on all sides of this issue, from degrees of Baltar’s evil with a lower-case or capital “E,” and how the character rides a fine line between sympathy/seduction and hated traitor.
>>She was having a breakdown hearing that. She was falling apart. How >>would you guys take that? “Oh, yeah, I found god, but you should know >>that I only found him AFTER I helped destroy the whole human race.†>>Screw that. I love Baltar, he’s my favorite character, but sorry, not even >>I would have let that slide.
Disapproving of Roslin’s immoral attempt to hasten Baltar’s death is not equal to letting Baltar “slide.” In fact, they are separate issues.
>>Finally, Mary McDonnell does a lot with the character that is not always in >>words. The thing is, you have to pay attention to the body language and >>the facial expressions just as much as you pay attention to what she is >>saying. Once you guys start to realize that, then maybe, just maybe you >>will get to the crux of Roslin’s true nature.
Roslin’s a complicated character. We’ve spent many hours analyzing her and her interactions with other characters on the show. We’re always happy to hear new insights on characters or anything else to do with BSG or other sci-fi.
>>…you guys, podcast after podcast, never take the time to even remotely >>comprehend the character.
Like I said, we welcome new insights and ideas on BSG and other things as well. If you’d like to discuss your thoughts on Roslin, please feel free to join or start a new thread in the forum at http://forum.galacticwatercooler.com/
>>I think that once people make up their minds to dislike a certain >>character, they will always try to find things to continually convince them >>that their dislike is valid.
This may be true in some cases. I don’t think it’s accurate of us.
By the way, I’ve included a link to a blog post from last year about why I think Roslin is underrated and dealt too much criticism as a character. You may find it interesting:
http://www.galacticawatercooler.com/2007/03/23/our-roslin-ourselves/
@audra
Saying something like “it is often the preferred identifier depending on the individual” indicates that it’s a PC term. I’m not anti-PC either, I think it’s appropriate, for example, not to refer to the native people in the americas as “indians”.
An individual can call themselves whatever they want. But, it is clearly a bit wacky to call a black person from England, or even worse, a black person from Africa, an “African American”. What exactly is “american” doing there? I think that in general, the idea is “ancestry”-“nationality”. We say “asian-american” sometimes, can you imagine a Japanese person in Japan referring to themselves as “asian-american”? Wouldn’t that be a bit silly, even if that person wanted to be known that way?
And, re the “ignorant” comment. I didn’t say the discussion was ignorant, I don’t think it was, just the usage of the term as a blanket term for black people.
Lordy, Anon. It’s not the first time a Canadian actor has been mistaken for a USian. Relax.
The funniest thing is that Audra sounds more Canadian that Elosha.
Sorry. As I said, it was a pet peeve, and I wasn’t thinking it was a mistake, I was thinking it was just an unconscious usage of the term as a universal term. Mistakes like that are reasonable. I have thought many canadian actors were american. However, on BSG, I have learned to expect canadians, the cast is loaded with them. I’m dropping it now. Carry on everyone.
Anon
I understand your frustration. Sometime people don’t think. I think that Audra really did assume the actress was an American. She does not sound Canadian as many of the other Canadia cast members do. I don’t think what you said was wrong – but you could have been a bit nicer about it. Audra, Sean, and Chuck are nice people and they really don’t ever mean to offend anyone.
Amee
I’m sorry – but Roslyn trying to kill Baltar is not right. I don’t care what he did. She alone doesn’t get to decide who lives and who dies. I totally understand why she would go crazy over what he said. It still does not mean she can just let him die and it be okay.
Also – please remember that everyone has a right to their opinion and if you don’t agree – disagree respectfully.
oh sheesh. guys. chill. not hard to know that she meant no harm. stop being poopypants.