A Very Special Poll In Which Either Sean Or I Will Lose A Quarter

As you’ll hear in GWC Podcast #41, Sean and I — getting a little punchy toward the end of the ‘cast — laid down a quarter bet on the following question which we hope you’ll answer for us:

Who’s “cooler?”

  • Darth Vader: 59% (197 votes)
  • Gaius Baltar: 41% (135 votes)

Total Votes: 332

Sure, this is likely to land us the same kind of press as the one-off “Galactica vs. Enterprise” comment got us, but hey — we were tired, it was the end of the week, and a bet is a bet.

To be fair to Sean, I’ll post my own arguments in comments where he can do the same.

Note: This poll is closed — and I frackin’ lost. But thanks for all your participation in settling the issue!

80 Responses to "A Very Special Poll In Which Either Sean Or I Will Lose A Quarter"
  1. Dalek Kent says:

    Vader, winning on the tie-breaking “we refer to our little girl as the Pink Lord of the Sith” aspect.

  2. Chuck says:

    I’ll make more arguments as the week progresses, but these are my basic reasons behind the bet:

    While Darth Vader is undoubtedly one of the greatest sci-fi villains of all time*, Gaius Baltar is much “cooler” because a) he gets a lot more action with the ladies, b) he’d be a hell of a lot more fun to hang out with on a Saturday night, c) he’s not a “crusty old white dude,” (that’s a Chasing Amy quote for those wondering what’s wrong with me), and d) we get to see more than twenty minutes of him on screen every three years.

    Of course, you’ll be the final judge — even if you will undoubtedly find yourself egged on by both of us all week.


    * I, too, paid for all three of the Star Wars prequels (and suffered Mr. Binks, among others) with only minimal bitching for the sole purpose of seeing The Man don the suit for a few moments at the end of III. That’s probably the best argument for voting for Sean’s view, but I thought I’d throw it out there anyway.

    PS: The word, as ambiguous as it might be, is “cooler.” (Yeah, I should have defined it better before producing a quarter. My bad.) Think of it like this: Whether you’re a republican or a democrat — and regardless of how you might vote — who’d you rather spend a weekend with: Bob Dole or Bill Clinton? See my point?

  3. Moe says:

    Since the question is who is cooler the winner is Baltar. Starbuck, Six and Xena tip the scales in his favor.

    If the question was who is more of a Badass – the results differ.

    Also – if the only Star Wars films ever to have been made were eps IV and V then we just might have a different winner.

  4. Audra says:

    Hmm, this one is so tough, because I think Vader and Baltar have very different cool qualities. But…I admit I have a faded ringer tee with Darth Vader as well as a cast iron keychain of Vader I keep on my nightstand, lol. (It gets me going before I go teach.) So even though I’d rather play poker or wake up next to Baltar, I gotta go with the original Man in Black here. (Well, ok, the second original Man in Black. Sorry Johnny.)

  5. Architect says:

    I’ll have to go with Baltar. And really, I have sort of the same rationale as Moe in the above post. Imo, Vader would be tops in who was the more “badass” – I mean, this guy can crush your throat while having a teleconference with you, for pete’s sake. Wait. Maybe I’m remembering that wrong. Er,… but still… can Baltar crush your throat? Swipe your blaster from your hand after deflecting shots from a fast draw? No. But “cooler”… well, there’s the rub. I go with Baltar only because his story is more compelling, it has more depth. Credit goes to the writing and the actor too. And it is unfair to compare the 2 characters. Baltar has had the benefit of appearing in almost over 50 episodes to flesh out his character. Vader only has 6, and even than, the set up was only in the prequel, AotC, and RofS.

    Plus, yeah – he is so full of himself that its hilarious but he’s a charming devil. Vader? I’d just be scared to death of him – back track round the last corner when he’s walking up the sreet; cross to the other side of the road. That’s just not cool. Imho, of course, tho ymmv.

  6. Timbuck says:

    I made my decision and juxtaposed cool vs badass BEFORE I scrolled down and saw many of us have the same pattern of thought. Baltar is defintely cooler; I would hang out w him at a bar and scam on chicks. I would’ve loved to have a friend like him in college.

    The real badass debate is from the AFI top 100–or maybe it was something at Halloween. Greatest/scariest bad guy–Hannibal Lecter or Vader? To be more specific Vader 1977-1983 and Lecter in Lambs and Red Dragon only. That is a great debate imho.

    No doubt who is cooler if we go original Baltar (the late John Colicos) vs Gaius Baltar (and his harem)!

    Yet another reason this is the best podcast there is…

  7. Techie says:

    Darth Vader is cooler for these reasons (in no particular order, i am making this up as i go): One, he achieves true love with a chick, and not just any chick, Natalie Portman. Now no hard feelings toward tricia helfer or lucy lawyless and I am certainly not saying that i would turn down a chance to have a threesome with them, but Natalie Portman has something that the other two just dont have. And he actually falls in love with her, he doesnt just use her for a good frack/chance at life, he really loves her (of course that leads to her death, but nevermind). 2) Say it with me now LIGHT FRACKING SABER, can you come up with a more cool weapon? I mean what has baltar used, some pistol that he barely knew how to use from point blank range to shoot crashdown? And yes, the pen may be mightier than the sword, but baltars ‘manifesto’ that he hid in his pants are no competition for a lightsaber 3) Cool lines: other than the whole butterfingers thing, what good lines has baltar come up with? compared to Vader? I mean there is Luke I am your father, or Now I am the master. Not to get started on “your lack of pants disturbs me” and that whole thing. 4) Vader is one badass fighterjock, both as Vader and anakin, what I would like to see is a Vader vs Starbuck poll. 5) Vader can choke people through tv screens. 6) We can give him a pass on the whole hooking up with chick things cause of the fact that he cant get out if his suit 7) speaking of suit, darth vader helmet and matching black armor suit thing vs. Gaius’ pinstripes cmon 8) Vader blew up an entire planet just to make a point, he wasnt subverted into it, or manipulated, he just felt like it 9) Voice, yes I think James Callis is amazing, and his aragon (sp?) accent was amazing, but compared to James Earl Jones, psh.

    Anyhow, those are all the reasons i can think of at 2:30 in the morning when i have an 8:00 class in five hours. Sorry for the very long post, and keep up the great work.

  8. Techie says:

    P.S. Vader scores points for the whole “tell your sister, you were right . . . you were right” Deep down inside Vader was a good guy, and I would much rather have a beer with a guy who deep down is a good guy, can admit his mistakes (of which there were a few) and also, isnt trying to hit on every woman in the room (more competition).

  9. gafra says:

    C’mon, how can Gaius compete with a dude that was born to wear black, is 75% bionic (think about THAT when it comes to pleasing tha ladeez..) and has his own, personal empire of badass starships to command, not to mention his own little planetoid that can just sidle up to whatever planet he chooses to blow it to smithereens if he’s having a bad hair day.

    Anyway, Vader singing “All along the Watchtower…” has GOTTA sound better than Baltar’s wheedly little voice any day.
    AND Vader can pilot a TIE fighter,
    AND Vader has cool sunglasses by default,
    AND Vader sired a pair of kick-ass kids, one which is the saviour of his people and the other looks amazing next to a giant slug,
    AND Vader was able to freeze dry the second coolest dude in the universe (Han Solo),
    AND Vader makes black work,
    AND I bet Vader could whup Baltar’s ass at Poker (with those dark shades & James Earl Jones voice who could tell when he was bluffing?)

    Mind you…Baltar’s ability to get himself into the middle of a Cylon chick sandwich counts for a lot! Never saw old Darth gettin’ it on with so much as a blow-up pleasure droid, did we?


  10. gafra says:

    And another thing…you ain’t ever gonna see Darth pussy whipped by an imaginary girlfriend..or for that manner by anybody…

  11. Cavatar says:

    Before I vote I need an answer to this question first…

    Are you talking about the Vader before we saw how he became Darth Vader? I ask this because my impressions of Vader changed after seeing Episode I, II, and III. I think he was a much cooler villain and character the first time around. Once Lucas made the prequels I feel he took something away from Episode IV, V, and VI. I no longer seeing him the way I did before.


  12. StevieSpin says:

    Gets more action with the ladies? I don’t think Darth Vader was looking, was he? Moot point there.

  13. Ray says:

    To be fair to Vader, I think if he’d wanted some action with the ladies they wouldn’t have turned him down as he has the jedi mind trick. It just wasn’t his thing.

  14. Ray says:

    Because the term ‘cooler’ is ambiguous enough to make this close to a coin flipping decision, I had to go with the criteria of who I’d rather see more of. And although Jesus-Baltar isn’t as cool as Season 1&2 Baltar and Head Baltar, I’d definitely rather see some more Baltar than more Vader.

    I agree with above though, Vader is definitely more of a badass. Although the badass quality does add to Vader’s coolness. As I said, it’s a close one.

  15. Goldschmied says:

    Merriam-Webster Online gives several definitions for “cool”

    1) moderately cold : lacking in warmth

    –> I would have to say that Baltar is way hotter than Vader. 1:0

    2) marked by steady dispassionate calmness and self-control

    –> Baltar? Self-control? 1:1

    3) marked by deliberate effrontery or lack of due respect or discretion

    –> Yeah, this round goes to Mr. “as of now, I am a candidate for the presidency” 2:1

    4) (slang) Excellent : All right : Fashionable, Hip

    –> hey, who’s more fashionable here? The dude with the mask in the black plastic suit or trendsetter Gaius with the back-to-basic kimono? 3:1 !

  16. Techie says:

    I disagree with goldschmied.

    for number one, Balter is hotter therefore he does not satisfy number one, one point for vader.

    2) Dispassionate calmness and self-control,I agree with, Vader totally wins

    3) Vader blew up an entire world to make a point, i would call that deliberate effontery and lack of respect.

    4) that helmet is badass hip.

  17. Mike P says:

    I have not listened to the podcast yet, so I am casting a purely unbiased vote! Darth Vader is the archeytpal bad guy (or was until we got all that lame-o backstory in the prequels — talk about your demystification!). But archetypes are rarely “cool” (Gandalf being perhaps the exception). Baltar is a three-dimensional character who we are still arguing about whether and to what extent he is evil . . . and any character who can spark that kind of discussion rates as “cool” in my book. 🙂

  18. Luc says:

    Had they not come up with the prequel movies, I would have voted for Vader. But now that I have seen how Vader came about, especially the whiny little blond kid… I’m with Baltar.

  19. Browncoat Bryan says:

    I have to say Vader. I don’t think Baltar is a “bad guy”. I think he’s incredibly narcissistic, but not necessarily evil. Sure, he made some bad choices and he always looked out for himself.

    But, Vader??? Man, that was a BAD ASS. And I think because of it, his redemption was much more powerful (come on, how many of you all DIDN’T cry when Vader died and the ending funeral scene???).

    The dude took the swing at Obi-Wan when Obi-Wan basically quit the fight in Episode 4. He took down a whole Rebel base AND killed several subordinates when they failed him. The other guys are like, “Oh, man. I hope he doesn’t pick ME to be the fleet admiral….” He chopped off his son’s hand AND threw a guy into a carbonite freezer, just as an experiment. And you know he was a bad ass when he told the New Death Star dude, “The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am” and the other dude almost choked (non-Force assisted). I don’t remember Vader being too forgiving. And Vader ALWAYS talked crap. “He’s as clumsy as he is stupid” “Impressive, most impressive.” “Your powers are strong, young Skywalker, but you are not a Jedi yet.” “Apologies accepted, Captain Needa.” “All too easy.”

    Oh, and to counter Luc, it is BECAUSE Vader started out as a little whiny “I wanna be on the Jedi Council” and “I love you so much, Padme, I can’t breathe” “You underestimate my powerrrrrrrr” brat and turned into the most feared force in the Universe that I have to give it to Vader. Talk about Most Improved Player!!!

  20. Pike says:

    I went with Vader. Just picture the two of them in the same room. Which one is going to intimidate the other? Vader, hands down.

  21. Armando says:

    Damn you! You’re making me CHOOSE! ARRRGH!

    (My brain just exploded. Thanks guys. Who’s going to clean this mess all over my office now?)

  22. Armando says:

    All right, mess is cleaned….

    I think Pike has a point: Baltar would be intimidated as all hell by Darth Vader. He’d run out of the room crying.

    …but Vader never had a threesome with Lucy Lawless and Trisha Helfer. That makes Baltar pretty cool in my book.

    What I need here is a definition of “cool.” Do you mean more bad ass, or smoother, slicker and more in control of himself?

    I refuse to vote until I receive a satisfactory answer. Or until I can include a write-in candidate, in which case I choose


    (I kid, I kid…)

  23. Pike says:

    Wow, cleaning up your own exploded brain. Now that’s cool.

    I think, since it wasn’t defined in the bet, that each person has to bring their own definition of ‘cool.’ I went with the basic James Dean brand.

  24. Sean O'Hara says:

    Lol Pike! Yeah, If Vader Met Baltar, Gaius would just wet himself and start crying in a corner while Six and Lucy fawn over Vader who is mostly machine anyway. Hands down Vader in my book. 😉


  25. Chuck says:

    I’ll make another plea: We’re talking “cooler” here, not “more badass” or “meaner” or even “better bad guy.” I’d totally vote for the (second) Man in Black for any of those three. But when I imagine saying, “Yeah, [insert name here] — he’s a cool guy.” — Vader doesn’t come to mind. Baltar does.

    Also, since this is such a badly put together bet, I’ll make another suggestion: I think we should compare the early Vader (read: Ep. I, II, III) with Baltar. (I’m sure Sean will differ for obvious reasons, but I’ll let him make his own points.)

    Also, when I think of Baltar, I don’t generally think terry-cloth robe. I think of (in Sean’s words) the “Baltar suit” — you know, that pinstriped jobbie he wore when meeting Six on Caprica. That’s stylish Baltar.

  26. Sean O'Hara says:

    Look at you all trying to work your cool under the radar… Look at this Baltar over here, he’s cool not the sniveling Baltar. Look at the kid Vader not the guy in the suit. That’s funny, totally wrong but funny.


  27. Armando says:

    Okay, I’m staying out of this one for sure. 😉

  28. Armando says:

    Okay, I’m staying out of this one for sure.

    Now, I happened to catch about half an episode of the original series, randomly, on cable last night. How about ORIGINAL Baltar? THAT was a square dude!


  29. Chuck says:

    Armando: All in fun, of course. 🙂

  30. Techie says:

    I completely agree with Sean, its all of Baltar vs. all of Vader. If we were just talking ep 1 2 3 (when he wasnt even vader) then yes, baltar would be cooler. I mean if I sat down for a drink with anakin, I would probably end up punching him in the face (of course he would probably lightsaber me, but thats besides the point). But vader, I would totally have a drink with. First off, hes gotta some interesting things to say. Also, he is so much more relaxed, and without constant motive. I could see myself have a real man to man conversation with Vader, whereas with Balter everything he says is either a ploy to keep himself alive or get into bed with some hotty. And that is just no fun to hang around with.

    And as long as we are naming other contests. Adama vs Elrond (movie version) for best scowl.

  31. Pike says:

    Chuck, Anakin wasn’t Darth Vader until he became a Sith, so I don’t think that his childhood comes into play here.

    Armando, TOS Baltar was still ‘cooler’ than Gaius.

  32. Ty-the-Giant says:

    I would have to go with Darth Vader/Anikin Skywalker

    Cool = Skills.

    Baltar: Computer Programmer, Statitiction, Cards, Vice President (not much of a skill unless your Cheney), and maybe he can do the swirl.

    Anikin: Racecar driver, mechanic, engineer (built his own robot), fighter pilot (one of the best pilots in the SW ‘verse), Jedi Knight, Lightsaber skills, moving things with his mind skills… etc etc

    And I am sure Anikin could have gotten more women, but Jedi are supposed to be celebit .

    Balter is maybe a bit less of a whiner then Anikin, but not by much.

  33. Ty-the-Giant says:

    I ment to write that Balter is a statistician.

    but I forgot to add a few more skill: 7) choke a man using the force… (cool, very sick, but cool) 8) Later in life, Darth Vader sounds like James Earl Jones. 9) he led an army 10) He had a Death Star.

    Darth Vader is like Adm. Adama, Pres. Roslin, Apollo, Brother Cavil and Agathon all rolled into one.

    Balter is like… Steve Jobs and Charles Manson

  34. Browncoat Bryan says:

    Okay, Baltar vs. Anakin…

    That’s not a fair matchup.

    I think it’d be fair to pit Anakin vs. Whiny Lee.

  35. Dan, the Lord of Kobol says:

    This is a really tough one, Sean and Chuck. Gimme a few hours to think about it.

    LOL@Chuck: “Crusty Old White Men”. Kudos to Kevin Smith references.

  36. Architect says:

    Ty-the-Giant: LOL re James Earl Jones comment. That shouldn’t count though since that badass voice was done through a synthesizer – remember his voice when they pulled that mask off in the end? Wheezer! OK, ok – he was dying at that point but still…

    Just playing.

  37. Chuck says:

    Architect: See, you’re making some sense there. While comparing Baltar to a 12-year-old Anakin might sound silly, it’s no sillier than comparing Mini-Series-whipped Baltar to New Hope ‘Vader.

    While ‘Vader was no doubt a bad-ass at times, he was also an underdeveloped adult emotionally stuck at the age of 13 for most of the sega, only finally unloading his teenage baggage in Jedi — right before he died. The main difference between ‘Vader and most teenies: the whole freakin’ galaxy suffered due to his angst instead of just his parents, friends, and teachers.  Doh!

    Also, are we talking persona here, or person? We’ve only seen under the mask twice, right? The first time it was a whiney, wooden Hayden Christensen and the second time it was a feeble old dude. Either way, I’d say that balances at least a couple of ‘whipped Baltar moments.

    And don’t forget Head Baltar. Sure, he only gets about as much screen time as de-masked Dearth, but he’s as cool as they come. “Too bad you nyuked it.’ Priceless. (I sure hope we see more of him in season four.)

    One parting shot: I’m not normally the kind of person to bring this up, but if you knew someone whom Six, Three, and Starbuck thought enough of to sleep with, mightn’t that person be reasonably described as “cool?” I’m just sayin’.

  38. writch says:

    I’d have to agree with Chuck’s definition of “cool in that last post. It’s sort of the gender-reversal application of the concept in Bowling For Soup’s “The Girl that All the Bad Boys Want.”

    In that context, Baltar gets my vote.

    However, I’d have to say that even Head-Baltar would (albeit metaphorically) pee his pants if a Head-Vader crashed the Projection Party – thus kicking sand in the allegorical eyes of the 90-lb Gaius.

    Chix0rz henceforth wander off with the Nu-Pimp on the block, Mr. MIB.


  39. Vin L says:

    Baltar got used by a hot chick/toaster and unwittingly got the colonies destroyed.
    Vader tortured his own daughter and cut off his son’s hand.

    Baltar got stabbed with a pen, by a guy who had a crush on him.
    Vader was burned to a crisp and came back in a sweet black outfit.

    Baltar was the boss and had a three-way.
    Vader threw his boss down a bottomless pit.

    Vader. The far cooler choice.

  40. Ty-the-Giant says:

    Ok, I will put aside my cool is as cool does argument.

    Head Baltar is as cool as they get; but he is not Baltar. He is 6’s idealized image of what Baltar is. 6 is in love with Baltar, and love is blind. My wife, when she isn’t mad at me for something stupid I did, thinks I am much cooler then I really am.

    Baltar’s view of himself in his own head is also very cool. However, this is also not the real Baltar. This is his own view of himself. In my daydreams I am also much much cooler then. In my dreams, I can spend the entire day having sex with all of my ex-girlfriends or a supermodel on some beach and say clever things… but this does not mean that I am cool in my real life.

    So, I agree that these two pretend Baltar’s are much cooler then Vader.

    But the real Baltar is just a playboy. He is a suck up. Baltar has the appearance of cool, as long as everything is just right. But anytime any amount of pressure is applied, he falls apart. The opposite of cool.

    Litttle things like; “I’m going to call my lawyer” or “I don’t think I’m the man for this job… I’m not cut out for this kind of work… why do I keep putting it off?…it my subconcious… my subconcious telling me I’m not the man for this job… ” The real life Baltar, when he can’t be the playboy is a Weasle…

    And as for Darth Vader being a 13 year old full of angst… Baltar has not matured much past 14. He never takes any responsibility for his actions and he thinks with his d**k.

    Cool Scale

    Head Baltar 8/10

    Day Dream Baltar 7/10

    Anikin 6/10

    Darth Vader 6/10

    Real Baltar 2/10 (20% cool, 80% snake)

  41. Ty-the-Giant says:

    And any cool points Baltar got for sleeping with Kara evaporated the moment she called out “Oh Lee … Lee”

  42. Luc says:

    Nah, now that I’m thinking more about it, Baltar is WAY cooler.

    Vader started out as an arrogant little brat fixing stuff up for a flying rat, fell in love with the first girl he ever saw, lived like a monk until he got old enough to loose his mind and virginity over her. He then immediatly gets tricked by an old dude named Palpatine into betraying the other monks and becomes his bitch, going as far as wearing the outfit the old guy picked up for him for the rest of his life while being mean to everybody else. Emperor P. eventually gets to fancy Luke Skywalker more, especially after he sees him kick Vader’s ass. But Luke manages perfectly fine to resist the Emperor’s charm, so Vader throws him down a well and proceeds to die.

    Baltar starts out as a farmer’s kid living in british Arkansas. Using only his wits and charm, he manages to become a dapper scientist rock star playboy living in the big city. Name one other dapper scientist rock star playboy… you can’t. That’s a much bigger accomplishment than twirling a light stick while dressed like a vampire with a nazi helmet. He does get tricked into betraying his own kind, but not by some old dude who looks like Peter Cushing. He gets tricked by none other than gorgeous Trishia Helfer (who wouldn’t), while still getting other hot action on the side.

    So, ok, Baltar doesn’t have all the fancy special Jedi mind powers. But he manages to survive both Xena’s finger cups and chopstick in the ear tortures by having a Head Six orgasm and then proceeds to have a threesome with both the fine ladies. THAT is impressive.

    Baltar is more like the Emperor, Vader is more like Gaeta.

    Baltar is cooler.

  43. AirborneAce192 says:

    Stop defending Baltar! He is not cool!

    Lets see, he sells out humanity resulting in near genocide because he can’t keep his fly zipped and some of you guys like and defend him? PLEASE!

  44. Chuck says:

    Funny story (even though it’ll probably hurt my chances of winning the quarter): Sean and I were playing Star Wars Battlefront II in co-op mode and we got to the part where you’re on the Corillian corvette and can assume the Vader role. The first time through, Sean assumes Vader and promptly starts force choking me.

    I’m like, “What the frack, dude? I’m on your team.” He’s like, “I couldn’t help it, I was Vader.” We lose, and start over.

    He does the same thing again.

    I’m like, “Stop it, you team-killing-fracktard!”

    So the next time, *I* assume Vader… and promptly end up force choking Sean. Audra walks in just in time to see me kill Sean and says, “Hey, isn’t he on your team? What’s wrong with you?”

    Sean says, “It’s OK. He’s Vader.”

    We never did finish the level.

  45. Saberhawk says:

    And Chuck – that is excatly why Vader is cooler. He’s Vader.

    Anyhow, if I was going to go with Gaius I would have picked a name like BaltarHawk…..and not Saberhawk.

    Don’t spend that quarter all in one place Sean.

  46. Armando says:

    I’d like to see Baltar force-choke someone. Does having sex with an imaginary woman count?

    (I’m still abstaining….for now)

  47. Chuck says:

    Saberhawk: As I mentioned at the start of the story, I understand that it doesn’t help my case.  In the end it’s not all about winning.  It was just a funny-ass story that I couldn’t pass up telling.

  48. Klucky says:

    It comes down to who would I rather have on a tee shirt; hence Vader.

    I also hate Baltar, but that dosen’t matter. I harth Darth.

  49. fuzzyelf says:


  50. joeedh says:



    Vader whined too much in the first three movies. I’m sorry, but that forever spoiled my view of him. And Vader never had any of the death stars! The first one was commanded by Tarkin, who it was made very clear was superior to Vader on the Death Star. The second one was commanded by the Emperer himself (after a vert short preperatory period of Vader having control).

    And his lightsaber was just a plastic rod. And if his force powers were so good, why couldn’t he just use them to throw the Emperor down the shaft, rather then physically carrying him and thus dying himself?

    And Darth Vader was never stalked by a guy (Gaita) 🙂 Only truly cool people suffer from that sort of thing.


  51. Pike says:

    Chuck, I think your story points out exactly why Vadre (to use the English spelling) is cooler. Where your metaphorical cart lost its very real wheels is confusing whom you would rather spend some quality time with, with whom is teh cool.

    Heck, I’d rather hang out with the Chief, but he’s in no way cooler than Papadama.

  52. The 13th Cylon says:

    Gotta go with Vader- and this is coming from someone who watched “Ep I: The Phantom Menace” last night! Season 1 Baltar would give Mr. Vader a run for his money, but Baltar got too slimey (literally, just look at the goo in his hair when he was spacing out in that one episode) while Vader continues to be cool. I will say that Hayden’s hair in Ep III rivals Baltar’s on the sweaty/greasy scale. Those wacky villians and their hair!

    And Chuck, it’s funny that you mentioned Battlefront II. That’s such a fun game. I really should get that for my 360 and download the old Cloud City maps. How could they leave Cloud City out? It’s the coolest SW location ever. Battlefront III should be incredible.

  53. Architect says:

    “And any cool points Baltar got for sleeping with Kara evaporated the moment she called out “Oh Lee … Lee””

    That…was…so awesome! Thank god(s) I didn’t read that at work or, drinking anything for that matter.

  54. gafra says:

    OK, the cool top 10:
    1) Darth Vader
    2) Papadama (sorry, the Galactica in re-entry gets me every time)
    3) Han Solo
    4) Saul Tigh
    5) Saul Tigh
    6) Baltar
    7) Saul Tigh
    8) Boba Fett
    9) Kara Thrace
    10) Ellen Ripley

    Yes, I think Saul Tigh is cooler than Baltar. Why? There is absolutely no BSing with ‘ole one-eye, he knows exactly who and what he is and is principled enough to stand up for what he believes in… Even when he thinks he’s a cylon. Unlike Mr. B, who seems to stumble through life with the sole purpose of making a more comfy life for himself.

    I mean really…in the mini series he was gonna pinch that old ladies’ lucky number to get a pass onto Sharon’s Raptor for crying out loud. Ain’t no WAY Saul woulda even thought about that. Let alone Vader who would flagged down the nearest passing Imperial Cruiser and then promptly finished off Caprica with his pet Death Star…

    Sorry, but at his core Baltar is just plain opportunistic: and if theres a bit of glory in it, such as something as minor as a Presidency with hot & cold running bimbos, all the better.


  55. writch says:

    Luc had the best breakdown yet…

    And I had the same reaction to Ty’s “Oh Lee!” comment.

    “All My Base Are Belong To (gai)Us!”


  56. Armando says:


    Saul Tigh could run rings of coolness around both Baltar AND Vader in my book. Boba Fett too (I never got what the big deal was with that guy. Other than the jet pack, secret weapons, silent coolness…).

    I’m still abstaining for now (I’m such a waffling flip-flopper. I should run for office!) but I’m leaning towards Vader. Sure he’s not as powerful when he’s in the iron lung suit as he was when he was Hayden Christensen, but he’s still one powerful dude. Still, while “Luke, I am your father” is a great line and a great moment in film, “no more mr. nice Gaius” is a far superior villain line. 😉

  57. Eric says:

    Baltar is cooler, Vader is badder. No two ways about it. You take Baltar to the New York bar scene and pick up the ladies. You take Vader to the Bronx if you need to do some a@@ kicking.

  58. Goldschmied says:


    I strongly feel that at least one “Saul Tight” on your list should have been replaced by “Mr. Data”


  59. Goldschmied says:

    saul tight… 😀 would you call that a freudian typo? LOL

  60. gafra says:

    One more element of coolness that I had forgotten about Vader…

    Who else in the galaxy can wear a CAPE and make it work?

    I mean, really, Superman etc are really just try-hards when it comes to cape work. Only Vader can instill awe while wearing a suicide-by-fashion cape. Gaius in a cape? I don’t think so. He’d look like some anaemic hobo next to Vader!

  61. The 13th Cylon says:

    Long live Tigh! He DOES run rings around Baltar and Vader on the cool scale. All the people who complain about the prequels will cease when George digitally inserts Mr. Tigh into random scenes when they have a special edition of those. Can’t you just imagine a scene in the Jedi council and have him wander through yelling “CRAAP!” or when Padme and Anakin start talking he’ll come in and say “That’s enough gods dammit!”

    Gafra- I agree, but everybody and their dog wears a cape in Star Wars. Well, except for C3P0 and R2. Vader does wear it the best though, it practically doubles his size and scary factor.

  62. gafra says:

    Mr. 13th, you are right, but wearing a cape and making it work are two different things. I mean really, Lando’s 1/4 length beige number…? It make a fashion statement I suppose, but not a good one. At least it would make Baltars suit look good!

    ps I can imagine Tigh in Luke’s place at the X-wing pilot’s briefing before attacking the death star…

    “CRAAAAAP….I used to wallop swamp rats in my old T13 at home from farther out, Gods dammit…”
    As replacing Han Solo in any Mill Falcon breakdown scene
    Vader: “Saul…I am your father”
    Tigh: aww…CRAAAAP…

  63. Luc says:

    Tigh is definitively the man.

    So is Brother Cavill, on the evil side of things. I loved it when he winked at Tigh and Adama, moments after he offered Baltar to “sweeten the pot”. I like to think he aimed that wink especially at Tigh. What a bastard.

    I hope that at the end of the series Tigh has a nice long showdown with him, that would be a fun dramatic moment. He has it coming… Two really great actors there.


    Oh, and
    Vader = Guided by the dark side of the force
    Baltar = Guided by superb blonde in his head
    Score 1 Baltar

    Vader = Bitch to old man Palpatine, bows down to him, calls him master…
    Baltar = His own man, others bow down to him (mainly women)
    Score 2 Baltar

    Just sweetening the pot…

  64. Ty-the-Giant says:

    Here is my theory… Tigh Saul is the one true Cylon God, I think he is the first model and season 4 is going to start with him opeining up a can off woop ass on those Basestars… “poke out my eye will you….well Craaapp…” (insert sith lighting/Avitar/Hero type special effect.

    no wonder Diana was so quick to apoligize. What would you do if you found out you god was an Old Testiment style alcoholic?

    Anyway IF Baltar is cooler then Darth Vader, it is only because Vader was saddled with George Lucas as a writer/director.

    George may be a genius, but as Harrison (or Fisher) is reputed to have said, “You can type this shit George, but you sure can’t say it”.

    Anakin Skywalker: You are so… beautiful.
    Padmé: It’s only because I’m so in love.
    Anakin Skywalker: No, it’s because I’m so in love with you.
    Padmé: So love has blinded you?
    Anakin Skywalker: [laughs] Well, that’s not exactly what I meant.

    -10 points of cool for Anakin/Vader.

    At least she didn’t say “oh Windu… WINDU!”

  65. rachel says:

    Anakin Skywalker: You are so… beautiful.
    Padmé: It’s only because I’m so in love.
    Anakin Skywalker: No, it’s because I’m so in love with you.
    Padmé: So love has blinded you?
    Anakin Skywalker: [laughs] Well, that’s not exactly what I meant.

    Yeah. Anakin was a wimp, no doubt about it. And once vader took off the helmat in the end of the 6th episode, he lost some (how do i put this nicely)…. non-old-crusty-white-guy points.

    But everyones gotta admit. With the hat, and without the Hayden….. Darth Vader can’t be beat.

    I’ve got love for the baltar, but all he does is take orders. And yeah, Vader does too…. but at least his got a nifty laser sword!

  66. Armando says:


    You crack me up! 🙂

  67. Pike says:

    Gafra, LMAO!

  68. RixMag says:

    “I think it’d be fair to pit Anakin vs. Whiny Lee. ”

    I believe OSHA requirements mandate ear plugs to prevent hearing loss from all that whining that’d result…

  69. Armando says:


    How about Lee circa “The Hand of God” or “Kobol’s Last Gleamin” vs. Episode III Anakin?

    And I’m no longer abstaining. Had to go with Vader. Sorry, Chuck.

  70. gafra says:

    Yeah Ty it wouldn’t surprise me if ole Tighclops went on a massive ambrosia bender once he discovered he was the number 1 ticket holder in the Cylon brigade.

    Mind you, if Tigh = God, Starbuck can officially claim she gave God a black eye. Now THAT is cool!

  71. 13th Cylon says:

    If they actually say “Tighclops” or “Ol’ One Eye” on the show when referring to Tigh, I will flip!

  72. Devo says:

    I think both characters are pretty fracking cool. Darth is sheer badass, but we are talking cool here. Baltar is smooth, good with the ladies, and can get himself out of every situation without the use of force. Baltar manipulates his enemies to get his way. Gauis relies on his intellect which is also more of what it means to be “cool” than forcing people to do what you want them to do with your super human capabilities. To me, that’s what it means to be cool. Blasting your way out of a situation isn’t cool, that’s being more of a brute than a “cool dude.” However wimpish Baltar may be, when he puts his mind to it he can be as slick, sly, and “cool” as the best of them. I put him right up there with Macgyver.

  73. gafra says:

    Well at the risk of sounding obsessive I’ve been considering this further consideration.

    IU think the greatest compliment you can pay a “cool guy” is to ask him to be your Best Man at your wedding.

    Darth? No. I don’t think he’d look good in a tux and I reckon a flower in hi lapel would…well…just be wrong. Darth can be a groomsman
    if he wants, but that at most. The future father in law can get him to do a “force choke” if the old cold feet start to get itchy.

    Gaius? No, by his actions he’s not really the kinda guy I first think of when I want sheer reliability and who I would respect enough to ask. He can be on buck’s show duty.

    Sorry, but my first choice would be Tigh, closely followed by papadama and then Chief. Anyway, Tigh’s best man speech would be worth it alone.

    Tigh. The coolest of the cool.

  74. Browncoat Bryan says:

    Hmmm… Tigh’s best man speech… add lines, everyone…

    “The speech… Where are my notes? Yeah, check under that Mad Dog 20/20 bottle. Ahhh… Here they are. Ahem… Marriage–. Hey, someone shut off that FRAAAAKING MUSIC!!! I can’t think in here. Where was I? Oh, yeah. Marriage. It’s great when your wife isn’t catting around with half the fleet.”

  75. White Nugget Center says:

    “Cool” can’t be whiny, fearful, and self-absorbed. Baltar is out of the running.

    “Cool” is clear, brave and self-possessed. Vader’s the winner in the contest, but I agree that Tigh, Papadama, and Starbuck all have the black-clad mouth-breather beat.

  76. RixMag says:

    ““I think it’d be fair to pit Anakin vs. Whiny Lee. ”

    I believe OSHA requirements mandate ear plugs to prevent hearing loss from all that whining that’d result… ”

    Whoo-Hoo! I got mentioned in the Podcast!. I feel so frakkin’ special. 😉

    RixMag: Name is Rick, and I drive a Dodge Magnum

  77. Pike says:

    Good on ya, Rick. And thanks for explaining the handle, as it obviously was confusing for some 😉

  78. Armando says:

    I know it’s a little late in this thread, but what about Tigh, Adama or Starbuck vs. Han Solo or Boba Fett?

  79. Pike says:

    Armando, meh.

    Fett=rocketed off to some doom via the curiously-convienient-to-everyone-but-him rocket switch. Han=frozen in something or other.

    Tigh and Starbuck go gangbusters on each other until Papadama lays the smackdown and tells them to knock it off and do their jobs.

    ~The End~

  80. Kawika911 says:

    Baltar makes a better villian. He has survived prison, a trial (which he was acquitted), and a beating. He served as a lame duck president during a cylon domination and drank the whole time. He had a gun pointed to his head and just looked at the gun and said “shoot me”.
    Also, Baltar (in the old series commanded the cylons).
    Vader died, was burnt, and shocked. Baltar is still living. A living villian makes a far superior villian then a dead one.

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